SONGWRITING COMPETITION - SWC036 August 2020 - Winners announced

[Double Tap]

Hi everyone, my entry:



I tried to blend neurofunk with some sci-fi elements, and also some little orchestral stuff... So, I think it would suit more a spaceship race-battle game, idk.
I consider it still an early concept, but I don't have much time to polish it so I am submitting it anyway.

Most of the sounds (main bass, main drums, pads, leads) where designed by myself.
The orchestral brass & mallets come from ableton live orchestral packs and collision.

Some tracks that inspired me :

!	Bonus Info
	https://soundcloud.com/nocidbusinessrec ... the-future https://soundcloud.com/nocidbusinessrec ... tive-space

Some pictures that inspired me :

!	Bonus Info
	https://wallhaven.cc/w/0qqo5r https://wallhaven.cc/w/mpz5pk https://wallhaven.cc/w/nry2v1 https://wallhaven.cc/w/zmrpxw https://wallhaven.cc/w/d55xxj

Ok, now, thechnical details.

DAW: Ableton live 10

Used synths (that I remember):
- NI Massive
- DS Diversion
- DS Thorn
- Cakewalk Rapture
- Live's Wavetable
- KHS One

Used effects (that I remember):
- KHS Disperser
- NI Raum
- SoundToys little plate
- Izotope Trash 2
- DS Tantra
- Live's Multiband compressor
- Izotope Ozone 9 elements

What I like: That fizzy bass at the end in particular that comes in at 3.25ish. But there are so many great sounds. The concept of the sci fi sounds works really well.

What I liked less: I felt that there are so many build ups but they never quite delivered. I kept thinking - this is going to be the drop. No, this bit. Ah, he's been teasing us and this is the moment... But it didn't quite get there. When the drums fade out at about 2 minutes it builds again and there's a false riser that would make a great drop. The specific points are at 0:46, then again at 1:19 or 1:30. But it's an excellent piece of work.

[Mister Fox]

Hi folks,

I've promised some more feedback, so that all of you can continue working on your material before the deadline reaches.

Please keep in mind - you can edit your posts. So please do so rather than re-posting. Although I will find your most recent versions and collect it for the global song collection post - just something for the future to reduce the chaos a bit. Also, I hope to see more entries by the end of the week - extended deadlines and all. Yes, that also means your entry, @functionform.

I might not be able to comment any further than that - busy with behind the scenes work and private stuff.
But I want to continue to set a positive example for future games.

"Afterburner"


...

- I got up to -11.3 LUFS, as reported by TDR Limiter No6. Without any limiting, it was already hitting -13 LUFS, and I needed to control some peaks here and there, so it got a bit loud, but that's really something to expect from these genres. I don't like -5 LUFS neuro, but I always go a bit over -8 LUFS, I think it's part of the genre aesthetic.

I really hoped to hear something along the lines of what you produced. And I wasn't disappointed at all.

Let me tell you, "Trash" is not mandatory for DnB - it does make things easier though due to it's (surprisingly) brutal waveshaping and possible parallel processing. But I'm not telling you anything new here - whatever gets the job done.

I really like your overall concept - however, two things I'd love to see you change:
1) a different snare, or dropping it in pitch and making the sustain longer (for more impact), maybe even adding some reverb (with pre-delay to make it "beat enhanced"). You're more knowledged in this area than I am, so maybe got by your gut instincts.
2) don't pull the track too long into "half-time". The second half slows things down too much IMO. Why not pick up the pace/"brutality" again at 2:34 - this way you only have a slow breakdown - not the whole second half as well. More Neuro, less "Dub".

I'd maybe also pan the 4/4 ride a bit - everything feels a bit center. But hey, I understand the "club centric" design.


Regarding the loudness... you can pull back with Limiter No6 (or Limiter 6) if you (for example) use the first compressor as input gain control. This way you can pull things back to -14LUFS. You can still make your track impactful (with summing bus compression) while still keeping your transients alive and quite literally on fire. This device is not an easy to tame beast, that's for sure.

Gridlock
174bpm

(revisited version)

Host
Cubase Pro 10.5

I'm enjoying the improvements there, and i finally listened to your production on headphones as well (which add a lot of bass to my listening experience). You could in theory make the bass even more prominent - but I wouldn't push it too much anymore (maybe by 2dB max).

Two changes I'd still do:
1) at 1:46 (in the breakdown section), you could already start with snare hits that get faster and faster until the roll at 1:54 sets in - create some excitement and "foreshadowing"
2) you added some more "rides"/shaker type sounds starting at 2:18. But I'd actually change it out and/or enhance it for a classic acoustic ride sound. Maybe more like a ride-bell actually. Also, you used 8th notes, not 4th ones (so ride on 1, 2, 3, 4 and not on 1-and-2-and-3-and-4-and-). In theory, you can set them in even sooner.

Can't add much more I'm afraid.

"Midnight Run"

DAW: Reaper
BPM: 175

VST:
Steven Slate Drums 5.5
...

Interesting approach here as well. But what is a bit off-putting, are the drums. The snare "weakens" the whole production IMO. It definitely needs to have more impact - and I would opt for one with lower pitch, longer sustain and definitely a bit more compression. Maybe side-chain "duck" to make the snare really in-your-face. This alone should drastically change the feeling of the song. In fact - this is what makes or breaks the song (IMHO and all that).

Then I'd also throw in the occasional crash cymbal ever so often (transitions). Also interesting that you threw in drum-loops towards the end of the song. But what really stands out here, is that they are not(!) quantized. The "Acoustic Set" drifts too much from the loops - making the production feel a bit disjointed. Maybe revisit that.

Don't be afraid to use panning in the part between 2:47 and 3:11. Create some excitement in that breakdown.

The last section also has some weird melodic transitions - but I understand the experimental nature here.

"Amen, Brake"

174 bpm

DAW: Tracktion Waveform 11

...

This is all still a bit new to me since I downloaded my first daw in May, so I'm sure there are some obvious problems with it.

You definitely went the classic "Darkstep" route here, with the oldschool Amen Break (re-arranged). Not what I expected (I wanted participants to go more towards "Techstep" and "Neurofunk", where you have clear accents on the "1" of the beat). This would be the main thing I'd ask of you to get back to and maybe revisit. If you can't get a more clear defined "1" - maybe break up the Amen break (hah!) rather than let it keep on rolling. And while you're at it, maybe also address the "clicks" that you hear with certain re-triggering. I know, oldschool and all - but this is a bit distracting (doesn't sound quite "vinyl crackle"). I also kind of miss the shaker in the "remixed" version now - which was more prominent in your first iteration.

In general... I would break things up a little - you have some very interesting ideas here, some good concept of sound design. It just feels... too much that never really gives you room for breathing, and of course it does not feel that modern (subjective opinion of course).

But if this is your first steps into songwriting, and you've merely started in May... hats off to you. Even if might not make it to the winners podium, you've already won by participating in the first place. I hope we'll see you join in future games as well.

"Hyperboost"


I tried to blend neurofunk with some sci-fi elements, and also some little orchestral stuff... So, I think it would suit more a spaceship race-battle game, idk.
I consider it still an early concept, but I don't have much time to polish it so I am submitting it anyway.

I must admit, I really like the sound effects in this production. I'd love to know what main synth was in charge of that.

Other than that, this was the energy I hoped to hear. Although I would maybe (once more) change the snare a bit (pitch and/or longer sustain). What I sadly miss (like in most other productions) is a 4/4 ride to add more tension. There is already something there (something that feels like a ride pattern), but the frequency range is too similar to the hi-hats IMO.

A bit distracting (especially on headphones) is the main melody... it feels "too wide" on top of the wide "reese" (which could have more growls in the low frequency spectrum/center as well - there is basically only the kick drum).

Your production is also super loud, exceeding the recommended maximum loudness for the competition. But this is your first entry - and I really hope you can revisit this track.

Here's my unfinished version that I managed to do before the original deadline.

”Gatekeeper”, Olli H
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aUkch0 ... sp=sharing


Very hard for me to do anything without a melody line and "real" instruments. After having listened some of the submissions, I realized I'm doomed to be the last in this months game. But at least I tried.

I say this off-hand... I really hope you revisit this production before the deadline has been reached. Very interesting ideas here that can be expanded upon. Drastically even.

Like the main bass melody... use more distortion (example: distortion > flanger). You already started to go that route, but maybe try a different waveshaper (like a parallel setup, Izotope Trash, SoundSpot Ravage, you name it), go to town. I guess this is also RealGuitar here... if so, one hint form my side: Guitar -> LPF -> Distortion -> some Filter movements > slight flanging. Check out the Venus Theory tutorials on Post #3 again on "bass creation".

Then the drums... Oh boy... the beat is there, but please replace the sounds. Check the third post again with some free stuff from Loopmasters, ErbNDubs or even Black Octopus Audio (the "teaser" pack has some outstanding aggressive drums from "Leviathan"). This is your weakest point here. Then maybe add some highly compressed and band-passed (LC maybe at 600Hz and a HC at maybe 12kHz) drum loops in the background ever so often, to "dirty up" the production.

One clearly hears that this genre is new to you - but you bring a lot of ideas from pop rock. It just feels like you need a little... push.





Overall - great entries so far.

You folks really try to step out of your comfort zone, try to experiment, and I love seeing that. Some of you took the "soundtrack aspect" a bit too literal however - but hey... who says you can't fuse hard hitting drum and bass with some orchestra elements? It's what has been happening in the audio realm for years at this point (the code-word is "Epicness").

Including today, there are still 2 days left to work on your material. Please do so.
Please continue to interact and give feedback to each other. I see that you like this new concept - let's keep it up.

[Clueless]

Edited

So, as there has been an extension until 28th I thought I would upload a version, as feedback welcome
I attempted to Master the track, but I may have pushed it too far

[Mister Fox]

Oh hi, C64 SAM - haven't heard from you in a while.

Interesting attempt (like every entry so far), but some ideas for improvements.

1) the drums (kick and snare) need to be louder. Like... they should feel "on top" of things. The busier the arrangement, they more they drown in the mix. Strong sidechain-compression (ducking) might help

2) the snare feels erratic in places (especially the syncopated ones). Out of sync actually, which throws you out of the loop. Maybe try to quantize it a bit, or nudge it in such a way that it feels more natural. Speaking of the snare - maybe add a second layer to it that makes it sound "fuller" / lower. Alternatively - use two different snares to separate the main beat from the syncopated hits and rolls.

3) maybe experiment a bit with panning (from the various sound effects you're running), to make some space for the bass. There is a lot going on, and the stereo field feels a bit narrow in places.

4) Your production is also fairly mid-heavy... you might need to look at your frequency spectrum a bit to clean that up.


Else... nice track. But don't forget (if you manage to get back to your production) to add some rudimental documentation and make your track downloadable.

[Clueless]

Oh hi, C64 SAM - haven't heard from you in a while.

Hi Mister Fox,

I’ve been playing the mix challenge to try and improve, whether it’s worked or not, it’s hard to tell .

So I deleted the version I uploaded earlier and I’ll try and work on your suggestions.
My biggest problem personally with the last mix was it was way too shiny, however it’s always good to get a second pair of ears to critique a mix

Ps
No samples of the Commodore 64
It’s all home brewed with synths and a voice VST

[Mister Fox]

You could have kept your song online for others to listen to, and give feedback as well. I'm not "the client" - I'm just showing how this could go in the future (interaction). But great to see that you want to revisit the track.


Regarding the C64... "SAM" is a speech synth - the two voice snippets you had in your song clearly sounded like that. If you created that through other means... great work. Whether it was Sonic Charge BitSpeek (although HEAVILY altered), Plogue Chipspeech, a DOSBox thing, or some other vocoder type deal. I don't mind either way.

[J.Ruegg]

Comments SWC036

!	Bonus Info
	WARNING: This feedback is aiming solely at the core concepts of neurofunk. and also on the premise of a race videogame OST.

Jilliam

Drums 1/5:
Tempo seems too slow for neurofunk, also, the drum patterns are way off dnb.

Neurofunk tends to have the classic pattern:

Code: Select all

------+v---------------v---------------
kick  |x.........x.....x.........x.....
------+--------------------------------
snare |....x.......x.......x.......x...
------+--------------------------------
hats  |..x...x.x.....x...x...x.x.....x.
------+--------------------------------

at around 160-180 bpm

Reese bass 1/5:

The reese bass is fundamental to neurofunk, and, I don't really sense such a bass in there.

It's done normally with 2 detuned saws, that go trough a lot of distortion and filter modulation, and it also is very expressive, giving you anxiety or such emotions.

Overall Vibe 3/5:

I think it could kinda work on a videogame, just one thing that I don't find good is the slowdown of tempo, maybe if you would have added some fast percussion in between it would mantain a sense of urgency on the race.

Doc Jon

Drums 4/5:

Good work on the drums, maybe some more dramatic drum rolls would have added a bit of flow.

Reese Bass 3/5:

I feel the bass is too quiet, and not too agressive, but it's still a nice reese, simple, but nice.

Overall Vibe 3/5:

I like it, would fit well in a race game.
I have just a complaint and it's that effect (sounds a bit like a tire screech). I am not sure if it was a good idea to have it.

JorgeElAlto

Drums 6/5:
No complaints, it's perfect to me.

Reese Bass 4.5/5:

I like the overcooked reese, I just think it needs to be more agressive, but anyway, it's very good.

Overall Vibe 4/5:

Nice track, bien ahí .

TrojakEW

Drums 2/5:

The groove feels more like BigBeat than Neurofunk, still, nice groove.

Reese bass -1/5:

I didn't feel any reese on it. But! it got a nice cinematic feeling to it

Overall vibe -5/5:

I really like this, and I can definitively see it on a videogame, but maybe not exactly a race game. maybe a more stealth mission spy kind of game.
Or maybe on a 2D racing game.
Have you considered making stock music?
I think you nailed it pretty well on a cinematic kind of thing.

becsei_gyorgy

Drums 3.1415/5:

It goes into the neurofunk vibe... but I feel the drums too weak, also I find that sometimes you fire too many snares too close.
It can get a bit boring to the ear (hearing the exact same sound repeated so often / so close), but! it can also be used as a nostalgic effect on the old videogame soundtracks (SNES, tracker modules).

The 3rd drop has much more variation on the drums, I like much that part.

Reese Bass 0.99999/5 :

I think, that's a good old 2010 dubstep bass, could be used every so often. but not as the main bass (speaking strictly on the neurofunk genre).

Overall Vibe 4/5:



Double Tap

Drums ?/5:

Classic amen break right there, and well, you got the DnB feeling, but it's not exactly what I was expecting from neurofunk.
Enough variation to keep it interesting tho.

Reese Bass 0.1/5:

Your bass game is too weak, and also, slow & too passive.
The drums have a lot of the energy energy tho, but the bass keeps behind of it, and doesn't add up to it.

Overall Vibe 2/5:

Could kinda work on a videogame, but maybe more for a persecution kind of scene, as a main high energy race theme, it's too weak.

Olli H


Drums 1/5 :

I think your drum sample selection doesn't quite fit the style, sounds too weak & too acoustic.
The programming is ok tho, but adding some more top percussion would make it much better (shakers & hats).


Reese Bass 404/5:

No reese bass found.

Overall Vibe 1/5:

The melody evoques some nostalgic feelings in me... but not exactly the kind of vibe you would want on a super high speed race competition, where the only thing that matters is to be the fastest. And also, maybe destroy the oponents with missiles

[J.Ruegg]

"Hyperboost"


I tried to blend neurofunk with some sci-fi elements, and also some little orchestral stuff... So, I think it would suit more a spaceship race-battle game, idk.
I consider it still an early concept, but I don't have much time to polish it so I am submitting it anyway.

I must admit, I really like the sound effects in this production. I'd love to know what main synth was in charge of that.

Thanks, it was done with NI Massive (the old one), but the core sounds where done with a lot of post processing, the source could be done with any synth.
Also, a lot of resampling was done to archieve the desired results.

Other than that, this was the energy I hoped to hear. Although I would maybe (once more) change the snare a bit (pitch and/or longer sustain). What I sadly miss (like in most other productions) is a 4/4 ride to add more tension. There is already something there (something that feels like a ride pattern), but the frequency range is too similar to the hi-hats IMO.

Yep, I agree, a more metallic / acoustic ride could have worked better.
The thing is, All the drum samples (except a shaker loop) where synthesized by me, and I am not good enough making metallic sounds... it was fun anyway.

A bit distracting (especially on headphones) is the main melody... it feels "too wide" on top of the wide "reese" (which could have more growls in the low frequency spectrum/center as well - there is basically only the kick drum).

I widened it on purpose, otherwise it didn't sounded as I intended.
On the low end, I didn't added a sub bass. that would have make it much more tight and impactfull. I agree, there is space to fit more elements.

Your production is also super loud.

Thanks for the compliment .

[J.Ruegg]

!	Bonus Info
	Warning : rant

About loudness.

I am not a mixing engineer, nor is mixing a thing I'm passionate about. I'm more into sound design, and "music" production... maybe noise maker would fit me more.

That being said, I don't know how to make it less loud, just... make a -20dB gain? and submit a file that hasn't been normalized?

I have been watching this contest for a very long time. I finally decided to join this month because, well, it was neurofunk, and I thought it would be more permissible with the rules (as neurofunk is LOUD!!!).
I know how egocentric our host is about the rules... voting system and other things. So I won't try to persuade a change on them.

But I just couldn't make it less louder, it would have seriously affected my piece of art and I would have feel bad about it.

So, I feel good about the loudness on my track, my producer friends with who I have frequent contact said it was ok too, no one complained...
Maybe it's just a generation gap thing, I've been intoxicated with the "modern" EDM kind of music and I have been used to make things loud . . .

IDK.

Anyway, if I get disqualified or receive less points, I'm ok with that.
I just feel that some rules are pointless, and it's a burden to follow them, don't really enhance the participants experience nor make it fairer for everyone.
I know people outside who have been on the fence of joining, and think like me. But again, maybe this wasn't a contest for me.

[Mister Fox]

About loudness.

...


Anyway, if I get disqualified or receive less points, I'm ok with that.
I just feel that some rules are pointless, and it's a burden to follow them, don't really enhance the participants experience nor make it fairer for everyone.
I know people outside who have been on the fence of joining, and think like me. But again, maybe this wasn't a contest for me.

Ah the good old commentary on "some rules are pointless" and "I know people who have been on the fence" commentary, hinting at "there would be so much more participation, if...". I'm getting used to it at this point, as I hear this at least three times a month through various channels.

Funny though that the Songwriting Competition barely has any strict rules other than "name your files properly, give credit where credit is due, give feedback to other participants and cast your vote after the submission period has ended (else you're disqualified)", and that's really it. I mean, even the TL;DR rules don't mention any severe limits. You never had a limitation on used tools (some twists apply ever so often), most of the time the theme and genres allow for a wide spectrum of creativity, you could "change your production until the deadline has been reached" since January 2020, etc. The only big change this month is "you are now encouraged to communicate even during the submission period". And from the current responses, it's been taken with welcome arms.

At this point, I really don't know anymore how to make things even more engaging. Other Songwriting Games are way stricter in places, most of the time there is barely any interaction. Yet there it's literally not a problem. But you do you, I guess... I... really don't know what else to say.



The recommended -14LUFS loudness limit has a reason however. That is to learn how to create "impactful music, without squashing it to bits". There have been (and still are) Electronic productions that are at -12dB RMS avg, yet are also "compacted" (due to careful summing bus treatment, notice: not squashed!) and still feel loud.

For the Songwriting Competition, I hope that people slowly adapt to pull down their music again, to re-learn the importance of transients for drums. You can still compress the sum as artistic element (Rock and Electronic especially benefit from that - this is an artistic choice, not because you have to since it's been "a thing" for 15+ years). But the higher you push your loudness, the less "good" your production will ultimately sound, the more "ceiling" your MP3 needs to have in order to prevent clipping, Example: at -6dBRMS that needs to be -1dBTP bar minimum to not let old DACs barf constantly. As somebody that mastered albums super loud - I sadly speak from experience.

So what to do:
Your track is currently "glued" to -6,5LUFS ILk, you barely allow any "dynamic movement" of your production for effect. Everything is constantly loud and in your face. Again, you can still use summing compression (like VladG/Tokyo Dawn Labs Limiter 6, or Softube Drawmer S73, etc) to gel things together. But if you pull back about 6dB (avg) before hitting the master limiter, your track should still feel loud, yet has been allowed to breathe.

That is what this particular rule is about.

I know how egocentric our host is about the rules... voting system and other things. So I won't try to persuade a change on them.

We (as community) or rather I (as host) have to set ground rules for everybody. But you must learn to differentiate between the Mix(ing) Challenge and the Songwriting Competition - as they are two different beasts. One has the focus on "learn how things are handled in the real world/industry", the other is "just be creative".


However: the defacto future right now, is that the Dolby/Soundcloud collaboration (Mastering on Soundcloud/powered by Dolby) finally set a Loudness Limit, and that is apparently -14LUFS (source). So if you master "loud", your track will be pulled down in the future (loudness normalized on playback). Just like any other streaming platform does currently. And due to the lack of transients, your track will sound more quiet and also a bit lifeless.

"Loudness Normalization" for SoundCloud has been a topic since 2016, but there was never a target value (there was one hinted at during AES#142 in Berlin, Germany, but that kind of vanished into thin air). So to be future-proof, and from personal experience with way better received releases, I decided early on to go with the same value that has been a well established/long known LUFS target/standardized value for Spotify, Tidal and Amazon. In fact, I initially adapted the K-System with K-12v1 (Amber Zone used only sparingly during Forte Fortissimo passages) as absolute maximum. LUFS values easier to handle/reproduce.

I am not disqualifying any entry for that for the time being - currently it is "just" highly recommended to not exceed -14LUFS, and yes, you will loose out on one extra point (as per the "Bonus Point" mechanic). Again, your music can still be impactful without being squashed to bits. I might change this and be more strict by early 2021 however (since I always have an eye on the the constant shifts of Loudness Targets for various platforms).

The Mix(ing) Challenge is a completely different topic though - there this is a point for disqualification, and it is absolutely mandatory to never exceed -16LUFS as that game is about mixing, not mixing and mastering. But this discussion has been done ad nauseam.




Ultimately - it is your choice what you do. I've opted to provide mere feedback. Some of that you even agreed on.
I'm just trying to provide some cornerstones for future games in terms of interaction.